We should be getting the book just before the date suggested.

I have book already, thanks again Alex! Now I'm not being critical here, because I've been looking forward to reading this for a while now, but we have to be careful not to venture into 'epic novel' territory. If some of you thought Screwtape was long-winded, I would hate to subject you to 470 pages of Hemingway.

aight aight...i see the point...I'm not objecting to this book at all, I just wanted to put it out there that one of the few rules is no James Joyce small print biblical epics

Hemingway has one "m".

From Wiki:

The Spanish Civil War was a major conflict that devastated Spain from 17 July 1936 to 1 April 1939. It began after an attempted coup d'état by a group of Spanish Army generals against the government of the Second Spanish Republic, then under the leadership of president Manuel Azaña. The nationalist coup was supported by the conservative Spanish Confederation of the Autonomous Right (Confederación Española de Derechas Autónomas, or C.E.D.A), monarchists known as Carlist groups, and the Fascist Falange (Falange Española de las J.O.N.S.). Following the military coup, working-class revolutions spread across the country in support of the Republican government, but were all brutally put down by the army. The war ended with the victory of the nationalist forces, the overthrow of the Republican government, and the founding of a dictatorship led by General Francisco Franco. In the aftermath of the civil war, all right-wing parties were fused into the state party of the Franco regime.

The Nationalists (nacionales), received the support of Fascist Italy and Nazi Germany, as well as neighbouring Portugal. The Soviet Union intervened on the Republican side, although it encouraged factional conflict to the benefit of the Soviet foreign policy, and its actions may have been detrimental to the Republican war effort as a whole.The United States government offered no official support for the Republican side, although over two thousand Americans volunteered on the Republican side. American corporations such as Texaco, General Motors, Ford Motors, and The Firestone Tire and Rubber Company greatly assisted the Nationalist army with their constant supply of trucks, tires, machine tools, and fuel.

The war increased international tensions in Europe in the lead-up to World War II, and was largely seen as a proxy war between the Communist Soviet Union and Fascist states Italy and Germany. In particular, new tank warfare tactics and the terror bombing of cities from the air were features of the Spanish Civil War which played a significant part in the later general European war.

The Spanish Civil War has been dubbed "the first media war", with several writers and journalists covering it wanting their work "to support the cause" Foreign correspondents and writers covering it included Ernest Hemingway, Martha Gellhorn, George Orwell and Robert Capa. Like most international observers, they tended to support the Republicans, with some such as Orwell participating directly in the fighting.

Like most civil wars, it became notable for the passion and political division it inspired, and for atrocities committed on both sides of the conflict. The Spanish Civil War often pitted family members, neighbors, and friends against each other. Apart from the combatants, many civilians were killed for their political or religious views by both sides, and after the war ended in 1939, Republicans were persecuted by the victorious Nationalists.

An estimated total of 300,000+ people lost their lives as a consequence of the war. Out of them probably 120,000+ were civilians executed by either side.

I Fear that I am not an established enough member of this illustrious club to say this but, shouldn't it be against the rules to pick a book that you have already read, and already have opinions on.

I think each person can choose what they wish. Personally, I am making it a rule for myself to choose a book I haven't read. I would rather use it as an opportunity to read a new book. But I have no problem if other people choose books they've already read, as long as I haven't!

I think the most important rule is to respect people's book choice no matter what they pick.

If, say, Alex chooses a book and the others say "uh, no thanks" and he chooses another to please the crowd, can we really say that the book we end up reading is Alex's pick?

Obviously, if someone chooses volume 1 of Das Kapital unabridged, this rule goes out the window and I will lead the charge, pitchfork in hand.

the other rule is that loyal members of the book club should attach a picture to their profile...

AND, we shall email Mr. Bradley every day until we here from him. I for one, long for his dark and dry humour.

I think I will start reading the book tomorrow, since I'm a slow reader. How many weeks do we have to read it? Considering that it's almost summer and that we all have events to attend to. I would suggest a two month delay to finish the book. What say you?

I Vote for no change in time lines due to changing of seasons. At that rate we won't be reading my book until November, and frankly I want to read it now. I also would like to formally request to be placed above the absentee Dr. Bradley in the list.

I got the book and am about 10 chapters in so far. I, for one, am really glad we have picked Hemingway as I really like what I have read from him.

In the spirit of Hemingway, I have also made the decision to go "running of the bulls" in Pamplona in July. If my posts stop after that point... now you know why in advance. Next on my list is to go fishing for Marlins...

just finished the book last night...for the last 200 pages I could not put it down. 5 stars, absolutely amazing. I must read more Hemingway. Anybody else finished?

I am a little bit behind, and will have to take the book with me to South Africa. May be a good read if I get bored during a match...

I still have about 200 pages to go, so it's good to know that "I won't be able to put it down"...

Juraj, I trust that you brought your Hemingway to the World Cup so that you can catch up at halftime.

It's real hard.

Finished it up last week. Hemingway was a master of his craft. Any word from Juraj so we can start discussing this thing? He was as far along as I was a few weeks ago.

Sorry... I didn't check the board for the last while. I finished just before I went to Pamplona, and took a picture of myself by the hemingway statue next to the bull-fighting arena. I can totaly see how the whole San Fermin encierro and festival could have been quite inspirational. It was hard for me not to be pleasantly overwhelmed by the whole thing. I honestly have never been to a place/festival/party with a better atmosphere.

Anyway... about the book. I thought it was good and somewhat "typical Hemingway". No frills... just the details needed to set up the characters and plot, and then the climax. The thing I liked in particular was the fact that it allowed me to better visualize the whole Spanish War thing. This is one conflict that I could not really picture in my head, and I think that is mostly due to the fact that most history classes and books tend to kind of just "glance" over it, without going into too much detail.

So what fictional novel during the time of war will Mr. Wright select next? War and Peace???

I finally managed to get through the book. Here are my thoughts:

Firstly, Hemingway has a way with words. I totally felt in the story from beginning to end. The characters were vivid and very human. The story itself is somewhat a testimony of the whole Spanish civil war. I did find Jordan's inner dialogue a little redundant and tiresome. I also found Hemingway to be man of his times, in the sense that the role of the woman and her stereotypes were very well defined and that there were no room for any changes.

My big beef about this book is that the build-up was never ending. I was expecting the bombing of the bridge to take place sooner, but the story went on and on, and no bridge. Of course the denouement had to be on the very last chapter. I was not expecting for it to be on the last chapter. In retrostect, it could not have been otherwise.

I was not alluding to the fact that you chose a long book, but that so far, both of your pics were semi-fictional novels written during a war. As a result, I referred to "War and Peace" due to the fact that this falls into the same category as your previous pics. Don't misunderstand... I love Hemingway, and I was very pleasantly surprised by your other pick as well.

I personally liked the inner monologues of el Inglés... I don't think Hemingway was doing anything other than setting up the characters in the book. Through the characters, he showed the many different approaches taken to conflicts. I.e. everyone has their own reason (including the other side) for being there, and everyone has different fears, regrets, limits, aspirations, etc. In the end, it is a conflict between humans, and as a result, based on the choices of individuals (e.g. Golz's dedication to the attack due to the momentum already in place).

What I didn't like, is the fact that I could almost tell the exact instance where the "development" in the characters stopped, and the "climax" started. As soon as I read about the guy on the horse wondering into their camp while Robert Jorda was in his sleeping bag, I couldn't help but feel like.... alright... now we are done talking about all the "soft stuff" and it is "go time"!

I really have to read up on the Spanish Civil War a bit though! I can't believe how completely clueless I am about that one.

P.S. Whose turn is it next to pick? I want to start ordering...

Hey Juraj, not sure if you saw this. It's dew's pick and she's chosen In the Time of the Butterflies by Julia Alvarez.

Is this all the discussion this book is going to get? I hope not...

I guess the one part I didn't know how to interpret... so i'll throw it out there... is what did Pilar actually see in Robert Jordan's hand? Was it his own demise, or was it the demise of everyone in the group? If she knew he was going to die, why did she "throw Maria at him"? Pitty? Also, why did she have the whole discussion about him taking Maria with him after, etc.?

It seems that Hemingway placed some importance on the "gypsy" rituals, traditions, and all superstitions throughout the book. I don't recall there being a single one that didn't come true. I think this is what Alex was implying when he mentioned that there was a lot of foreshadowing in the book... Yet, in this case, Pilar's actions are somewhat confusing if she saw the right future, while her not being able to see the future correctly seems to go against the general thread throughout the book.

Thoughts?

I thought that Pilar admitted at the end that the palm reading was BS?

This book was amazing, I have to say one of my favourites of the duration of our glorious book club. I really enjoyed not only Maria's story, and Pilar's story, but also the following chapter where it deals entirely with Robert Jordan's thoughts. I suppose I disagree with most in that I thought the most entertaining parts were Robert Jordan's inner monologues, in particular when he is debating his place in the world and his love for Maria. He was so fearless and then when he had something he wanted to hang on to he began to have serious doubts. His apolitical nature was also so pronounced in the setting of the Spanish Civil War. The conflict within his character and Pablo's character were very high points. Through simple language, Hemingway gets into each character and by the end of it I was feeling pretty attached, I can't remember the last time a fiction really grabbed me this way.

I really enjoyed the character of Pablo. He is still somewhat of a mystery to me, and I'm not sure whether to feel angry at him or sorry for him. Hemingway's character development is so good, it builds up and he reveals both despicable and redeeming qualities, in both the heroes and the villains.

excellent pick

one of my favourite Robert Jordan quotes: "To be bigoted you have to be absolutely sure that you are right and nothing makes that surety and righteousness like continence. Continence is the foe of heresy."

+1. Definitely my favourite part for the first half of the book.

I had the same feeling as soon as that happened, except I loved it. I saw it as the payoff of the slower-paced stuff leading up to that point. I think leo might agree with me on this one, as he says he couldn't put the book down for the last 200 pages or so. After that happened, I couldn't put it down either--so much action.

I'm not ashamed to admit I cried in the last chapter. I knew what was coming--didn't we all?--but it still got to me.

I found that to be genious: it shows how one little operation in a war has so much that comes with it. So tragic and so much loss of life for but one small part in a much larger war.

***

As for Hemingway's writing style, I think we all agree it's simple and vivid. I like how he seamlessly jumps from an omnipotent third person narrative to a kind of first/third person inner monologue by putting "..., he or she thought...", and then running with it from there. Take André Marty as an example in chapter forty-two (pages 420-421 in my edition--I just opened the book and took the first "he thought" I saw):

A couple lines later, he does the same thing, again jumping back and forth. Hemingway makes it look easy--what a master!

I love the Spanish in there, too. The other day, Roci and I went to a latino butcher shop. When the guy told me the meat came to $15, I found myself saying "Me cago en a leche de quince dólares!". Funny enough, he laughed and asked if I was Spanish.

Finished this book up yesterday and still in awe of the way it all carried through at the end. I think I too was convinced the bridge blowing was going to happen around chapter 12 or 13, but it was better to keep the suspense building. I can't remember the last time i read a book that was so enveloping. I totally believed that the thoughts and inner dialogue of each character was truly their own and not the invention of one man at a type writer.

The plot development was also pretty amazing to me, it's hard to imagine that the entirety of the book takes place with a small guerilla band behind enemy lines and yet with only a few flash backs to Jordan's time in Madrid we get a nice connection to the greater war effort and introduced quickly to the movers behind the attack which feeds in well at the end with the message arriving to Goltz just a touch too late. Just enough information is given to make us interested and to understand the character and their motivations, but there is really never anything redundant or tiresome about this to me.

I was really very taken with his dilemma right at the end to kill himself because the pain was getting too much and he did not want to pass out and be questioned later. The whole story about his father and grand father suddenly comes into play as he wonders if taking his own life right at the end will be misunderstood in the after life as a weakness, or even cowardly.

Also, the character of Pablo is probably one of the best I've encountered. Tracking his development trough the book and the foreshadowing of his betrayal was pretty epic and I really never expected him to return with more reinforcements, a great little twist. I actually half expected another even greater betrayal from this guy right to the last page! The fact that he kills all the new guys who came to help with the bridge just so that there will be enough horses to escape was pretty shocking. This lil nugget was totally unnecessary in terms of plot, but is yet another example of wholly engrossing character development right up till the end.

the ending was spectacular. I love how Hemingway doesn't spell it out, but rather leaves it to the reader's imagination. It ends the exact same way in which it began, with Jordan laying on pine needles. All of the thoughts about his grandfather made it so emotional. It was so sad the way it all went down, that it was more of a blunder rather than deliberate sabotage by Pablo that made Jordan have to stay behind. One of the things that I thought really made the reader feel a part of the story is that it is in real time. Every minute that passes is represented in the book. Like Scribbles, I also expected one final treacherous act by Pablo, but it never comes.

in keeping with his long held tradition of never logging into the site, Jon sent Alex and I his comments regarding this book:

"I just finished For Whom the Bell Tolls...finally no more mother fuckin Que Va's. In happy I read it, I appreciate Hemmingway's prose and descriptive writing and his insights into human nature, but god it was a struggle (as evidenced by the two other books I read in between). But when I focused and did get into it...it was pretty amazing how he captures the moment and you feel like it's you sitting in the forest waiting for a tank to come around the corner."

just came across this essay reminiscing about the Spanish Civil War, good read: http://orwell.ru/library/essays/Spanish_War/english/esw_1